Casual Relationships and Then Some

2018 Relaunch 9-years-after-this-post edit: At this juncture in my life (& I have no crystal ball to tell you about the future), I have no desire to be dating/in a relationship/with a life partner/married or have kids. For the first time (& after 20+ years of caring so much about this as the “end-all-be-all” life goal), I don’t care at all and am fully engaged in a relationship with myself. I love my own company, feel no lack, and – accordingly – feel complete and whole on my own; it is an absolutely revolutionary feeling and I wish I could have known it in my 20’s. More on that later…

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This blog topic is partly inspired by Vijay Uncle’s most recent status:  “Casual relationships are like placebos when you really need life saving medicine. It may not have harmful side effects but the time they eat up are harmful enough.” More from Vijay Uncle’s post later… This blog is also inspired by a recent commenter who referenced many examples of some of the most gorgeous and successful women in the world who were in relationships where they were abused, cheated on, etc. Although they are seemingly unrelated topics, I still believe they are inter-connected…

In no way is this blog meant to be a male-bashing; like every blog, I am writing so that we ALL look back at our past experiences and make sure we’ve learned something from them as well as reflect on what kind of results our current actions are getting and evolve as necessary… For starters, let me be clear that I think in every relationship, both parties have a part in how the relationship transpires and no one is completely innocent or a true 100% victim. I know I have certainly felt like a victim in previous serious relationships, but – had I listened to my gut – I would have either not gotten into those relationships in the first place or when I saw certain “red flag” signals along the way, I at least could have made like Forrest Gump and RAN.

Ladies, I have said this before and I will say it again and again because I beyond believe it’s true… WE are the reason for the often “bad” behavior of men.  When I look back at my dating experiences and even my just-liking-boys experiences from my teenage years, I realize that no matter how much love we got at home (if you know my family also known as “The Moon Household of Hugs,” I personally got a “like woah” amount), how wonderful our families are and how much we know better because we were taught things like “self-worth, esteem, respect,” us females still have this deep desire for attention, affection and ultimately, love, from that one guy.  Whether she dates a guy at 17 or 27, the majority of girls do not get into most dating situations/relationships, thinking that the relationship is casual or is going to end.  Even if she knows it’s casual for the guy, most girls convince themselves that they can inspire feelings of love and deep commitment in said guy by their actions.

That desire to be loved by and with one man is not the problem because I think it more instinctual and biological then some kind of choice we make; the problem is all the sacrifices women make, truly bad behavior they tolerate (abuse, cheating, etc.) and overall unhealthy and unfulfilling relationships they remain in when they should not.  I always say that if some of the most famous, beautiful, intelligent and powerful women in the world become “victims” of the aforementioned, then us regular people are even more challenged.

On that note, let’s take a trip down celebrity memory lane…

Some of the world’s most beautiful women who have been cheated on: Uma Thurman, Christie Brinkley, Denise Richards, Halle Berry, Reese Witherspoon, Tea Leoni, Heather Locklear, Elizabeth Hurley….

Famous women who were victims of abuse: Aishwariya Rai, Rihanna, Tyra Banks, Oprah Winfrey, Tina Turner, Tori Amos…

Side note:   Men, it is not okay to blame your “just being a man” and your biological makeup for your decisions, and – if you do that -you are no different than (for lack of a better animal example), an unneutered dog (I think that’s a fair comparison for someone like Tiger Woods) that tries to hump everything it sees.  We are HUMAN because we know the difference between right and wrong, we have the ability to make decisions based on how we think and feel, and we have a CONSCIENCE…  The below is an interesting article on how women can forgive men for cheating, but usually not vice-versa…

//www.lemondrop.com/2009/12/18/women-cheat-on-men-but-women-are-more-forgiving-when-cheated-on/

Anyway, I am NOT saying that women do not cheat on or abuse men (and I understand that the latter is not as well-reported due to the stigma men face nor does it get as much media attention), but I would say the overall #s are such that women are more on the receiving end.  I mentioned the above people not to liken their situations to our dating situations; however, to make everyone – men and women alike – think about… what they end up tolerating when they know they should not… when they ignore character-type “red flags” or compromise who they are for the sake of being in a relationship…  when they know it’s wrong or not going anywhere (basically tolerating casual when what they want it serious), but they still stay.

Both attention and affection can be addictive; I know very few people who do not enjoy both.  The thing is that we need to wean ourselves off that almost-drug and start using our brains a bit more.  Guys and girls, I am sure you’ve all been in this situation… where you feel like you are practically a boyf/girlf to someone, but they never commit for whatever reason… They put you in the friend or “I am not ready for a serious relationship” zone (for whatever multitude of reasons) even though that’s not what you want. They take your attention because they are not getting it from anyone else, but the second they meet someone who gives them attention that they want to be affectionate with, you are out of the picture.

I really believe that no matter how old we are, we should ALL be more upfront about our expectations.  However, if more girls actually told guys from the get-go that they were looking for something serious (since again, the majority of girls all are whether they are 14-34), then sure, a lot of guys would run in the other direction and that would be a GOOD THING.  We all get so caught up in the social norm of “not being crazy/desperate” or scaring the other person away that we end up being completely inauthentic and disingenuous.  Wanting to be in a serious, meaningful and fulfilling relationship does NOT make you desperate, and it really infuriates me that that’s what is now perceived by everyone out there.  Wanting that kind of relationship actually makes you very normal and shows that you value yourself and are at a stage in your life where you are ready to be serious.  (Hence, Vijay Uncle’s “Seriously Looking Albums.”)

Anyone who wants to be in something just casual or who is perpetually “not ready” or “seeing where something is going,” that should not be the kind of person you want to be with when that’s not what you want.  I know of many good relationships, but there are 3 that really stand out in my mind as being the kind of relationships that one day I wish to be in something like (they are of my brother and his wife, my best friend since I was 4 and her fiance, and my recently engaged friend and her fiance).  In these relationships, whether they dated for 6 months or 2 years before getting engaged, the guys were forthcoming about their intentions, persistent in their pursuit and SERIOUS, and the girls reciprocated accordingly making the same amount of effort and commitment.   I understand that a guy being that way comes from a feeling he has about that girl and that cannot be forced, but ladies, if you know in your heart that the guy you are with is not on the same page as you or he has managed to compartmentalize you out of his life (or into the background) for whatever reason, you have a lot of serious thinking (and hopefully acting) to do.

I really believe that at the end of the day, things are so jacked up now, because we all tolerate relationships/dating situations that less than meet our most basic expectations simply for the sake of a big fat “MAYBE” and not wanting to be alone.  We are also so caught up in this supposed social “norm” of not being perceived as “desperate” or “too serious” that we compromise ourselves and what we really want.  In other countries, it is very normal for people to get married in their very early 20’s, whereas here, CASUAL has unfortunately become the norm.

Here’s a CHALLENGE to everyone, but especially the girls out there:  Next time you are put in a situation that doesn’t jive with what you are looking for (let’s say for example someone putting you in their periphery as a casual option), confidently say “I am sorry.  I think you are *insert positive adjective(s)*, but I do not think we are on the same page.  I am not looking for a casual relationship/ hook-up/ etc.”  Say and mean it, and then more than anything, make sure your actions line up with your words and intentions.

Well, that’s all from me today.  Please see the first comment for more from Vijay Uncle on casual relationships and really consider how much of your life’s time you have wasted on “casual” and that you continue to waste.
As always, your comments, insights and opinions are appreciated (as always, whether it’s directed at me or anyone else, no name calling please!).

Write soon,

 

 

ORIGINAL COMMENT THREAD

Smile Moon said… Here is more from Vijay Uncle on Casual Relationships:
“I am referring to those who are at a stage of looking for marriage. They run into what they think may be a good prospect – they strike up the conversation – and see or talk to each other frequently and think that they are in a relationship. This is a comfort zone for both of them. Because they both can honestly say, “I am seeing someone.” They even go to spend some time together.

Only problem is that both of them are trying to figure out how to take the relationship to the next level. There are no defined rules – no referee! The relationship lasts 2-3 years and after many ups and downs (one more down than up for sure) they finally move on. To me that two to three years you spent is a big loss. The time wasted on this relationship could have been more productive in seriously looking elsewhere. It may leave one or both of them bruised and cynical.

For those who are seriously looking the time is of essence. And to waste few years on a relationship with open-ended process is a big loss. I have personally talked to hundreds if not thousands and they have admitted retrospectively that there were definite signs of ultimate outcome within weeks. So by their own admission they did burn up valuable time.

You are absolutely right that ill effect of marriage is far severe and I do not propose jumping into marriage to save time. I am simply advocating that whatever information you need to come to the decision can be done more efficiently and one should avoid the waste of time and pain that comes with failed relationship.
If both of them are seriously looking what excuse they have for not being able to get all the information needed to make decision in few months and than either move on or move forward?”

Anonymous (3:02 pm) said… Very interesting post. I could not agree with you more regarding how women should be more firm from the get go. However, the infrastructure in the American society is such that, even if 50% of the women out there took their stance and said “I am sorry, i’m not looking for something casual” and moves on, the guy will find another girl who’s willing to be in the grey with him, with no labels. He may go as far labeling the girl who has self-respect as too difficult, or too stuck-up or maybe even a goodie goodie. On a deep level, he may have respect for her and believe she’s the kinda girl to take home to mom and dad, but he will not be “Ready” for her ever because it’s too overwhelming. The chances of the girl, who holds onto something casual and grey with him and has 0 expectations is more likely to get him to the mandap.

Meanwhile, the one with self-respect, keeps going from one uncommitted man to the next. Of course, an element of this, like you said, is how much true interest their is between the guy and the girl.. But unfortunately, in your late 20s/early 30s we’re more jaded and as a result you see more selfishness, convenience and availability in people’s intent and less innocence and purity. I think the woman with self-respect will find what she wants one day, and probably be in a healthier marriage, but it’s probably with someone she did not consider for a while or was planning on never considering.

Anonymous said… I tend to agree with above Anonymous’s posting.  “The chances of the girl, who holds onto something casual and grey with him and has 0 expectations is more likely to get him to the mandap. Meanwhile, the one with self-respect keeps going from one uncommitted man to the next”.   I have seen multiple cases of living proof of the above. So what say, guys?

Anonymous said… @ Anonymous 1- What do you imply by “casual and grey”- casual sex, no commitment, or what? I am confused.

Smile Moon said… anonymous 3:02, what you are saying is very valid & unfortunately, probably completely on point. guys will always find girls who are willing to be grey, casual or whatever you want to call it. my problem is the part about being with a girl with ZERO expectations, uhh… does that mean being with a girl that is lying to herself & to you? i guess i could see how that flies…

something like the girl pretends to be so “super cool” & down for “whatever”/no pressure… she sticks around, you “connect,” etc. etc. & eventually the guy thinks “hmm… ok, yeah, this could work…” well, that all sounds really touching, but no thank you.

no, but seriously, i completely support all of that if you are okay with what that means (being disingenuous, playing games, etc.), but i’m not & i know a lot of girls are in the same boat as me. as far as i’m concerned, EVERYONE has expectations (including a whole lot of guys whose expectation is getting as much “casual” as they can until they deem someone worthy enough to be serious with), so why pretend like we do not?
you mentioned women w/ more self-respect ending up in “healthier marriages” & i’d rather be single for an indefinite amount of time than not end up in one of those b/c again, when i look at all the really good & admirable relationships that i know of, NONE of them were ever “just casual.”

ladies, i’m sure it’s uber-naive of me, but i still think that if enough of us (meaning not only people our age, but in their teens & early 20’s) started really respecting themselves (meaning not compromising themselves to be in something for sake of “being in something”) & completely owned their expectations/what they want, guys would be forced to change their behavior as well.

PDiddy said… Word.  But lets not forget this is a two-way street. A lot of really nice gents are being held hostage by girls who are shopping for an upgrade. We all know a girl like this.I think this goes back to your check-mark blog. You have two parties obsessing over finding their check-marks. And end up in some sort of grey-area-check-mark-hell.

I agree with your sentiment as well. But let’s modify the approach. The first thing you tell a guy when you meet him in a casual setting should not be that you’re looking for a serious relationship. Why not say, “I only date top notch quality men of character, substance and taste…” Its funny, cocky, saucy and still set the tone. Feel free to set further expectations on the first or second date. But right off the bat – does and will scare a guy. It should not, but unfortunately it does.

I mean think about it this way. What if some guy in a casual social setting came up to you a woman and said, “If you’re not going to marry me do not waste my time.” 9 out of 10 Indian ladies would bock at that. (Imagine a guy saying that to you at Crimson with the hip-hop blasting in the background…)

If its a serious setting like a setup or ‘infra-red dating’ etc… well then fine. I will also concede that I think guys set the grey area direction initially. And I will go further and say that most guys want to be in a committed relationship as well. But I think media, society, history, our community… has unofficially endorsed a double standard. Guys masculinity in many guy situations is judged by his ability to maintain grey are situations. And judge by the # of their conquests. I think if a guy is comfortable with himself that he’ll act pretty predictably like a gentlemen. (I have been made fun of at Sunday brunch and derided endlessly because I did not want to take the girl home the previous night.)

Just had a thought. I wonder if I could take a survey of masculine men who are metro and masculine men who overwhelming project their masculinity – and see who has more grey area relationships” Or perhaps a man who loves to cook… I am supposing that strong men that are comfortable doing feminine activities maybe more reliable?? I do not know – I am gonna investigate this weekend. 🙂

Smile Moon said… p.diddy! i missed you. 😛 ok, apparently you think i’m a slightly deranged person, so please let me clarify… i was NOT suggesting that anyone say what i recommended upon first meeting any guy/girl. what i was trying to say was that after making-that-more-just-initial connection, when you know you are being pulled into gray (& you do not want to go there), then to be transparent in your intentions.
i completely agree, upon first meeting if anyone said anything along the lines of “hey, if you do not want to get married, then thanks but no thanks” then everyone should make like forrest, & RUN.
i liked your saucy reply; i just do not know how much my lame-o self would be able to dish it out. sad, but true story.

def go do some research though… looking forward to your “results” & a lil’ more sauciness in my future. 🙂

Anonymous said… I completely agree with the comment made earlier: that the chances of a girl who holds onto something casual and keeps 0 expectations is more likely to eventually get the guy to the mandap. I think the trick however, is to ACTUALLY have 0 expectations. The problem with most girls is that they pretend to have no expectations, when deep down inside, the casual grey-ness is eating them up. The girls are SO into the guy that they do not date anyone else. Girls should keep the “pipeline” full and until they are in a committed serious relationship, be open to dating multiple guys so that if the grey ones do not work out, they haven’t wasted precious times in that casual relationship. In other words, if you want to hold onto the casual relationship, I think there’s nothing wrong with it as long as the girl realizes its nothing more than that… and continues her search for Mr. Right… Cause you know that the grey-guy is continuing his search for Ms. Right as well. And then one day if he decides you really are the one, and wants to commit to you, then great. But if not, you are at least leaving yourself open to the possibility of meeting someone else who strikes your fancy just as much as grey-guy and IS willing to commit.

Anonymous said… Hi, this is Anonymous (3:02pm) again. I am glad a lot of you liked my response! I basically think a few things are happening with Indian Americans, there’s a reason they call us confused! First and foremost, we do not know how to date because our parents were most likely arranged. So what we do instead is look for the most compatible person on paper like the good old arranged marriage system, as well as hope to have the perfect western story of spontaneously falling in love. The problem with this mindset is, the chances of randomly meeting someone who’s perfectly compatible on paper, as well as fall madly in love with them are slim considering we make up 3% of the US population. This isn’t how western dating works. In western dating, you date based on chemistry and then build on the relationship over time which eventually leads to marriage. White Americans, in general, are very open-minded, so there are no real show stoppers because the girl isn’t from the same state in india as you or doesn’t have a masters degree from the top 10 national university rankings on US News. This is where the whole casual grey situations come about with indian americans. I want to clarify what I mean by this. Two people meet randomly, they talk, there is MUTUAL chemistry, and they hang out over a course of several weeks. It becomes grey, when you’re not exactly friends, but not exactly more than friends ..so there’s some level of physical intimacy (i.e. kissing). If you’re not sure about this person, you put him/her in the grey bucket. For the sake of this example, we’ll use the guy as being unsure. This guy is probably a hot commodity, because for every indian guy who’s a good catch, there are probably at least 3 Indian girls to choose from. He dates one casually for some time and thinks “I will get back to this one” she’s not as smart as girl #2, or as young as girl #3, but she sure is cute. Indian guys are also most likely going to put an Indian American girl under a microscope, because an Indian girl in his mind, shouldn’t be too aggressive, or too fast, etc. She should be like his mom…

The girl, in this situation is intrigued by this guy, because he’s not taking her off the market, but at the same time doesn’t want to seem too eager and make him run for the hills. She figures, i’ll play it cool, be there for him, let him drive, probably because that’s how her mom interacts with her dad. She also tries to keep her expectations low to protect herself, and keeps dating because that’s the smart thing to do. She’ll go on dates half-ass and talk to more guys, but deep down like any sweet girl she “hopes” the one that is indecisive who she has chemistry with comes back and rescues her. Years pass by, and this is when we all rack up our back-up list with these casual relationships. It’s sad, that we should EVER have 0 expectations, but that’s where you head over a course of failed relationships. In general, relationships should be whole-hearted and self-less.

Unfortunately, over time this multi-prong approach of keep dating, but do not burn bridges is inevitable for the girl. Meanwhile, the guy, who is a decent catch has a few options.1) He marries an aggressive non-Indian girl who is not at all compatible with him on paper, and most likely less qualified than any of the Indian girls he’s ever dated 2) He tosses the whole western love story out the window, and plunges into a marriage with a girl from Bombay THINKING she’ll be like his mom and lives in complete denial when she’s everything but like his mom 3) He’ll pick one of the Indian American girls in the grey bucket while the other 2 he strung along are left behind. In the Indian arranged marriage system, as much as people mock it, the woman was protected from such. A girl and boy were matched on qualifications and looks. Once that was squared away, the families sealed the deal. Unfortunately, this system can’t be transplanted here. I think there will be less confusion in the next generation, but for now, the Indian girls in this country, DEFINITELY have the shorter end of the stick. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Vijay Mehta M.D. said… This is not about changing the society. Society will remain what it is. I would like to educate Desi woman in their mid 20’s today. They need to realize that their so-called relationship may be eating up her precious time. She is more likely to lose a decade only to find herself at a great disadvantage in Desi marriage game when she wakes up five to ten years later.
Here are few of my personal observations.

• Many Desi women did not have any idea of the price they would end up paying a lost decade.
• Women pay a much heavier price than men for procrastinating.
• From men’s point of view the peak of attractiveness occurs at late twenties. Guys are more visual than gals. For Desi women your chance of finding someone better does not improve with age after a certain point.
• Every failed relationship leaves you more jaded and hurt.
• Men are more interested in physical part of sex and women more in emotional part this puts women at a disadvantage. Women are far more motivated than men for a marriage or commitment.

I am not recommending for women to become blunt and tell the guy I am not interested in anything but serious relationship. But smart women need to do a lot of introspection at mid 20’s and lay a plan for finding that special someone. This plan needs to be critically reviewed for its success or lack their of every few months and be modified if necessary. And if that requires to remain painfully single for a while, so be it.
They need to be very clear about ‘fun track’ versus ‘future track.’ There is no denying of emotional and physical need. That is ‘physiology!’ But in process of satisfying your physiological need if you pay a heavy price ultimately then it is ‘pathology!’

Having so-called ‘grey’ relationship could end up costing you a lot. More people are likely to know about it than you anticipate. This may dissuade sincere prospect to make a move on you. Wishful thinking you get into may prevent you from being able to see a great opportunity that may come your way. You may not even consider a great prospect suggested by your parents or family.

In response to, “the chances of the girl, who holds onto something casual and grey with him and has 0 expectations is more likely to get him to the mandap. Meanwhile, the one with self-respect, keeps going from one uncommitted man to the next”. I have a different perspective on this one. Only brainless girls have zero expectation. If you are that woman, I urge you to ask yourself a question – what the hell is wrong with me? Consider professional counseling.

Yes, there is a chance that a guy would move on to the next woman who is willing to go grey easily than one who insists on knowing where is the relationship heading. But, that is a blessing and not a curse. May be you need to move on to the one who has emotional intelligence to understand your perspective. Being labeled ‘difficult’ by a chalu guy is far better than being labeled ‘too easy’ by most of the guys.

By & large if after six months of serous relationship you are not making progress it is time to move on. This does not mean it is never going to happen. But by moving on both parties have a better chance or realizing what they may be letting go. Get out of your comfort zone.

Of course we all realize that different strokes for different folks. No single formula works for everyone. Depending upon your needs and situation you may have to adopt a strategy that meets your long term (long is the key word) as well as short term needs. The successful strategy is one that achieves as much as your long term need without paying a heavy price. At this point in time I believe that Desi Women are paying a very heavy price for a lost decade in so called ‘relationship!’

VAV said… Uncle – LOVED what you have to say!
1. I completely agree with your perspective on “the chances of the girl, who holds onto something casual and grey with him and has 0 expectations is more likely to get him to the mandap. Meanwhile, the one with self-respect, keeps going from one uncommitted man to the next.” I personally believe that men like women who know what they want and are confident about themselves. What men do not want is the pressure to be in a committed relationship or headed to the mandap/wedding chapel right away.

2. What I love most about your comment is you advising people to move their focus if a relationship is not making progress after 6 months. Too often people get comfortable, or scared of leaving a relationship that is not so great because of the fear of loneliness or if they will meet someone else. They think “hey maybe what I have (even if it’s not the best relationship) is better than having no one.”  I am going through something very similar in my life and your comment is reassurance that I made the right decision. THANK YOU!

Anonymous said… I personally do not think women ever want to be in a grey relationship, they find themselves in one without knowing it. The bottom line is, it’s a guess every time. I do believe most women, KNOW to move on after some time (be it 1, month 2 months, 3 months, 6 months), but often times it takes another person to move on with, and if there is no other person or the next person turns out to be the same outcome, you end up in a vicious cycle. What uncle is saying is true, but the first posting is not saying be easy, it is just saying, that from their observation, they see that so much of this is not totally in control of the woman, but it’s controlled by society as a whole and the infrastructure of indian american dating supports men more than women. the ratio between the guys and girls is off.

Anonymous said… Yep. I agree. Indian guys are fully aware of how to play the system too! they want their cake and eat it too. that’s why you see many of them marrying from india or outside of the community as a whole. this isn’t as cut and dry as it sounds. it’s not like finding a job. emotions are involved. i know plenty of great moralistic indian women in 6 month vicious cycles.

Anonymous said… I agree with Vijay Uncle. Procrastination is not a good idea. I did that and God knows I am paying the price. So sad 🙁

Anonymous said… There’s no right formula. It’s going to work out for everyone. Even if it’s in their mid 30s. It’s just a matter of timing 🙂

Anonymous said… Isn’t being in the grey, be it a guy or a girl, mean that you just haven’t made up your mind? What is considered too long before you should let someone go and move on? or fully commit? Often times, people go back and forth in deciding for sincere reasons. There are a lot of stop and go relationships, because no one person is perfect for another. It’s a two-way street, both guys and girls do it. How often do two people meet, click right away, and live happily ever after? I think mostly just in the movies 😉

Anonymous said… I think this whole moving on after a few months advice, applies to a girl who is into a guy that’s being indecisive. if a guy is into a girl, and he knows there’s a chance, he could probably win her over with time and sweet gestures. most guys do not have the motivation to win a girl over anymore, but they could if they cared enough.

constructively honest said… You forgot Aniston. You also fail to mention that it takes another woman for the cheating to happen like Jolie.

Anonymous said… Brad and Jolie are looking to call it quits. Not that I like Jolie, but I think the issue is Brad. He’s not happy with either woman because no one woman can give you everything and he’ll always have another woman to go to. This goes back to smilemoon’s post comment on and ‘we search, and search, and search’ the real question is – is marriage obsolete.

Anonymous said… Whatever happened to unconditional love? People have all these criteria: cute, smart, young, the “it girl/guy”. So ridiculous, because all of these categories can come to end at any time. Pretty/skinny girls can gain wt. and become unattractive, rich guys can become poor. Let’s say you married the “it girl” and she becomes overweight after pregnancy or gets breast cancer and gets a masectomy. Or, gets into an accident and becomes handicapped. Clearly she is no longer the “it girl” and you are the “alpha male” still rich and powerful. Will you divorce your spouse because they somehow no longer look good and are desired by others?

Shared values, interests and respect are the key to a successful relationship and things like chemistry and other non essential things people place heavy importance upon become insignificant later on. At least that is what I hear from happily married couples who have been married for ten plus years. They also have compatibility tests out there. Romantic love and falling in love does not equal compatibility. Nor can a relationship be based on a frilly checklist. We are all people and whatever is up will go down and vice versa. I have gorgeous girlfriends who were skinny and beautiful before marriage and then gained tremendous amt of weight after pregnancy and look very diffrent now. Men can go bald too as well as gain weight.

Vijay Mehta M.D. said… “It’s going to work out for everyone.” – I wish I could say it to ladies in early and mid 40’s who tell me they have been looking for more than a decade. Que Sara Sara – or leaving it to luck does not always work out.

While there is not definite cut off time limit as to when one should move on – basically if there is no progress in few weeks one should explore the other opportunities. Let the procrastinator know that there may be a chance that you will find someone acceptable and move on.
There are lots of men and women who will tell you that they wish they did not waste years on someone in a wishful thinking mode. It is human tendency to wish that things will change while your brain is smart enough to know that likelihood is very low.
While we talk about the guys being indecisive there are many girls who do the same. So this is the advice for you if you are in a relationship where you are ready to commit but the other party is procrastinating at the same time tagging you along.
Is marriage on verge of becoming obsolete? – maybe for 10 -15% of you out there it is. But for the rest of you marriage does offer what you are looking for. So maybe the process should start with asking a simple question, “Am I the type for whom the benefits of marriage life outweigh the challenges of merging two lives?”

Anonymous said… I have noticed that in big cities people view each other as objects and not as multifaceted people. Real people. People are not objects. Looking around or waiting around for the next best object and leaping upon it. My friend, u shall be disappointed as there is no perfection in the real world. Perfect things become imperfect. All these categories we perceive as real are illusions and are quite transient. Why do not we relate to each other as we are and unconditionally accept each other?

Anonymous said… marriage is beneficial if you marry someone you respect and enjoy being with. so to answer that question – am i the type for whom the benefits of marriage life outweighs the challenges of merging two lives? yes, if it’s to someone you want to be with unconditionally. the problem is, how do you meet that person? if you decide to take a leap of faith, and end up marrying someone just to be married than you might be in the 50% divorce rate category.

Anonymous said… What if you’re the girl who makes fast quick decisions, and still cannot seem to meet the right person over a course of many many years? (whatever the reason may be, he’s indecisive, not compatible, guy turns out to be a freak etc etc etc)

Vijay Mehta M.D. said… Well, after two or three rejection in spite of sincere effort it is time to reflect. Look at you – the product, your marketing strategy and expectation. You should constantly make adjustment. Que sara sara does not yield better results. At the end of the day one should remember that happy marriage life is more a function of what effort you are willing to put in the marriage than the effort you are making to look for the perfect one. Once you have more than few turn downs you need to realize that common denominator is YOU.

Smile Moon said… oh wow, so many comments, so i will not address everyone like i normally do, but i did want to address a few specific comments though…

1) you’re right, i did forget aniston & it does take a jolie; however, angelina isn’t the one who made the commitment – brad did.

2) to the person who said it’s going to workout for everyone… this is not to be a debbie downer (especially b/c i am a VERY hopeful & idealistic person), but i have to agree w/ Vijay Uncle’s sentiments. i believe that we are a part of a generation where it sadly will not happen for everyone & we are seeing that already… men & women well into their late 30’s & early 40’s for whom it’s still not happening. we are in a time where things like “gray,” casual, multiple marriages, extreme superficiality/rigidity/non-compromising, etc. have all become the norm, that i unfortunately do not think we are all going to necessarily find “our ones.”
3) the general conversation above focused on knowing when something is going in the direction you wish it to (& this happens for both guys & girls), re-evaluating & if necessary, moving on. the goal for most is to be in less casual relationships that still take up significant time & energy.

4) a lot of you also talked about the superficiality of today’s relationships – how people seek the “it” guy or girl, but that those “it” factors can very easily go away. then what? i’ve talked about this before, but definitely more on that from me in the future…

Anonymous said… “Once you have more than few turn downs you need to realize that common denominator is YOU.” – That was harsh uncle! The turn downs are not always initiated by the guy by the way. I feel like a girl who has set the bar too high, has a harder time finding her match. Don’t tell me you do not know beautiful women both inside and out, from great walks of life, in their mid-30s making 6 figures who are still single. I sure do.

Vijay Mehta M.D. said… Yes, I admit that was too harsh. I know more than few amazing women who are good looking, talented, highly educated and making a lot of money and they are seriously looking for quite some time and some of them are at a point of giving up the quest to find the guy. Some of them are in mid 40’s. I think reasonable approach is to figure out what the available options are and choose the best from among them.

Actually, I had this discussion with one Leva Patel community leader, they insisted that the girls need to marry in their own group. And a simple fact is for every one educated guy there are two highly educated women. One need to figure out the solution – either accept that many woman would have to marry to a much less educated man or accept the fact that girls if they cannot find within the community may look outside.
We are in a state of denial. Just look anywhere and you will find that our women have far outperformed the guys. As a general rule the women are blessed with more beauty than guys. So, if women insist on wanting a guy who is equally good looking and is comparable in education and money making etc there will be a lot of women looking for a long long time.

Anonymous said… Way to tell it like it is, Uncle Vijay. This is why we love you!

Anonymous said… as a new reader, i must say I enjoy reading your blog…and Uncle Vijay is great too. 🙂 A lot of the things that were said…including the comments, resonated with me. keep it up…that goes to those commentators as well.